Education Discussions

I think it's only natural for your daughter to stomp back, after 12 times.  I think she shows that she DOES know right and wrong since she didn't stomp back after the 1st time like some kids would.  Good for her! 

Probably the only other way she could have ended it better would have been to walk away and surround herself with other friends.  Then he would have had a harder time going after her.

I am surprised, however, that the teacher was gone wit no backup.  In my younger days, the teacher wouldn't leave the room unless another adult would come in and supervise for 5 minutes. 

vivasuzi said…

I think it's only natural for your daughter to stomp back, after 12 times.  I think she shows that she DOES know right and wrong since she didn't stomp back after the 1st time like some kids would.  Good for her! 

Probably the only other way she could have ended it better would have been to walk away and surround herself with other friends.  Then he would have had a harder time going after her.

I am surprised, however, that the teacher was gone wit no backup.  In my younger days, the teacher wouldn't leave the room unless another adult would come in and supervise for 5 minutes. 

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I think it may be a bit difficult for a PE teacher to get a back-up in a quick and fast situation like that was.

My daughter's school is rewarding the children with good behavior all quarter by being able to dress up like their favorite superhero today. (If they have three of more infractions in a single week, they didn't get to do this. This daughter has been sent home with notes twice in three years, and the other time it was for kissing a boy.) My child is dressed up like Larry Boy from the Veggie Tales, complete with cape, mask, and "plungers" on the sides of her hat. Hope nobody tries to pick a fight today...

I was very easy to pick on when I was a child. I was always doing silly things and was very gullible, so I was an easy target. I would have probably been scared of that boy for the rest of the school year if I had been in her shoes.

Hmmm, I don't know if I necessarily think the reward is a great idea... ONLY BECAUSE some parents sometimes get madder then the kids when they find out their kid can't participate.  It really depends on your school district though.  I know teachers from Detroit that had parents come in and scream at them whenever their child was punished.  So I guess I have a slightly different perspective.

I think I made it through grade school fine b/c I was the youngest of 3 and for me it was never a big deal.  I never felt picked on, but also never felt like I picked on anyone.  I had my friends, life was good :)  Having older siblings go to the same school does make you feel like it's easier to fit in. 

When I read the first sentence "Well, my 7-year-old came home from school the other day with an infraction slip." I was going what in the world is a infraction slip. I always called this slip "Restriction." LOL!

I was small for my age in school, too! I can't remember any bullies bothering me at your daughters age. I think bullies are worse now than when I was in school. I think your daughter's reaction is normal. She was just protecting herself. I hopefully that boy got his "Restriction."  

krislynn said…

When I read the first sentence "Well, my 7-year-old came home from school the other day with an infraction slip." I was going what in the world is a infraction slip. I always called this slip "Restriction." LOL!

I was small for my age in school, too! I can't remember any bullies bothering me at your daughters age. I think bullies are worse now than when I was in school. I think your daughter's reaction is normal. She was just protecting herself. I hopefully that boy got his "Restriction."  

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Actually, he apparently didn't learn his lesson even though he also got an infraction slip or restriction. He did the same thing to another kid the next day and got hit in the face.

OMG! Sounds like this kid likes to be cruel. Thank goodness he didn't bother your daughter again.

Some kids take more than a slip :)  Hopefully he at least leaves your daughter alone.  You know what they say about boys though - they pick on girls they like!

When an adult hits another adult for no reason, it's assalt. When a kid does it and at school, it's detention for both the aggressive kid and the one defending. Something wrong with that picture . . .

I told mine not to start anything but to make it good if they had to fight back. I told the school official the same thing. She agreed but said that the rules are the rules.

In middle and high school, it's a "vacation" day rather than a slip. That oughta teach 'em huh.  

I have such a bully story about my oldest daughter but I have to go and take a shower because we are leaving in an hour!

No jo!  You are leaving us hanging!  Oh well, guess we'll wait :)

CyndiA said…

When an adult hits another adult for no reason, it's assalt. When a kid does it and at school, it's detention for both the aggressive kid and the one defending. Something wrong with that picture . . .

I told mine not to start anything but to make it good if they had to fight back. I told the school official the same thing. She agreed but said that the rules are the rules.

In middle and high school, it's a "vacation" day rather than a slip. That oughta teach 'em huh.  

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It does seem that there should be a better way to handle bullying. Some people just smile and say kids will be kids. They do take away fun activities that kids have to earn with good behavior at our school, so that may help some. I think the kids who are doing stuff repeatedly may need some sort of serious help before it gets to the point of violence that we've seen in some of our schools.

What's the story?

Katrena so sorry your little girl had to go through that... sounds like she handled herself well though.  Unfortunately the schools are not really handling these issues very well.  The biggest thing we do in the world is strip kids of power.  When this happens they act out in these ways.  Sounds like he got his power alright - and continiues to get it.  Many schools are going to a no-tolerance policy, which really tends to set kids up for failure instead of giving them opportunities to have power in a positive way.  Sad really.

I agree that so many policies seem to backfire or just plain don't work well. My daughter's school does have some wonderful staff members and they have classes where they are taught about bullying and what to do, etc.

No tolerance doesn't always seem to work the way you would think it should. I remember hearing on the news about a kid that got suspended because he told the teacher that his mom had accidentally switched her lunch with his and gave the teacher the steak knife. Now, what should the kid have done...hide it in his backpack?????

At least the bullies in my daughter's 2nd grade class have backed off somewhat for now, but my 1-year-old just about had to go to time-out in the nursery because she's trying to bully the other babies!

  I think that bullying is about the worst thing in life for some kids.  No matter what someone is going to decide they don't like you and that's that for them. My granddaughter is 10 and has even had to change schools because a boy decided he hated her and after big bruises, cuts and scrapes, breaking her glasses at recess, the principal still goes by "Well, boys will be boys" and did nothing about it. His parents are very proud that their boy won't take "nothing off of antbody", so we know where his ideas are coming from.

  Now she is a lot happier, but is always waiting for the next one to decide she's a good target. I went through this years ago(like 50 yrs ago) and the emotinal hurts are still there sometimes. I liked to play on the monkey bars but 3 boys decided no girl could do it, so they forced me to the top and then threw me off onto the blacktop. Soft surfaces weren't expected back then. I was sent home for antagonizing the boys, was in a cast from a broken arm, but the boys were just told to be careful. They ended up breaking the leg of the principals son, and only then were they dispiplined.  Doesn't look like times have changed much, no matter what the schools say their policy is.

zipknitter said…

  I think that bullying is about the worst thing in life for some kids.  No matter what someone is going to decide they don't like you and that's that for them. My granddaughter is 10 and has even had to change schools because a boy decided he hated her and after big bruises, cuts and scrapes, breaking her glasses at recess, the principal still goes by "Well, boys will be boys" and did nothing about it. His parents are very proud that their boy won't take "nothing off of antbody", so we know where his ideas are coming from.

  Now she is a lot happier, but is always waiting for the next one to decide she's a good target. I went through this years ago(like 50 yrs ago) and the emotinal hurts are still there sometimes. I liked to play on the monkey bars but 3 boys decided no girl could do it, so they forced me to the top and then threw me off onto the blacktop. Soft surfaces weren't expected back then. I was sent home for antagonizing the boys, was in a cast from a broken arm, but the boys were just told to be careful. They ended up breaking the leg of the principals son, and only then were they dispiplined.  Doesn't look like times have changed much, no matter what the schools say their policy is.

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Your stories are heartbreaking. It seems like our society goes by a whole different set of rules for kids compared to adults (like CyndiA was saying above). It's sad to know that people in charge of children could make such poor decisions. I'm glad that your granddaughter is out of that situation--she might find it helpful to talk to a guidance counselor about her feelings and I certainly hope that she is never bullied again.

As a teacher, I do not tolerate any kind of bullying that I see in my classroom or in the hallway near the room.  I will get right in the bullies face and shut them down right away.  I guess one of the benefits of being seen as a mean teacher is the fact that those kids just stop the behavior right away and high-tail it out of there.  They know I will do everything I can to get them into trouble.

njchicaa said…
As a teacher, I do not tolerate any kind of bullying that I see in my classroom or in the hallway near the room.  I will get right in the bullies face and shut them down right away.  I guess one of the benefits of being seen as a mean teacher is the fact that those kids just stop the behavior right away and high-tail it out of there.  They know I will do everything I can to get them into trouble.

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I think there's a lot to be said for "mean" teachers.

I believe that your daughter is in the process of learning right from wrong. By no means am I regarding your daughter's actions as wrongful, but she did get the infraction slip, indicating to her that another outcome may have been the preferred way. Although the other child initiated the confrontation, it seems from the sounds of it, merely got a slap on the hand. I also believe that teachers should also use the concept of rewards and punishment, something that most teachers are apparently unable to grasp.

Weekly problem meetings are good to get all the kids annoyances about each other out and together find a way forward, everyone feels calmer afterwards, but that works better from age 9

Thanks for your perspective, CarolynReynolds. My daughter is already saying that she misses her friends in school, so at least it wasn't all bad for her. She was actually tested quite roughly later in the school year. One boy told another boy that he liked my daughter better than he liked him. That boy found a staple and decided to scratch my daughter's arm with it. It bled and was red and sore for days. She didn't fight back and immediately told the teacher because the teacher was readily available (unlike the other time when she said the teacher was in the bathroom). I am very proud of my daughter, but I would not have blamed her if she had whacked that boy for physically hurting her.

I think they should have a more severe punishment for a child who starts the bullying than for a child that is clearly acting in self-defense.

It is rather challenging to be the parent of a bullied child or to have been bullied in the past. It can really damage a person's self-esteem and make kids afraid to be all that they can be for fear of more bullying.

Wow, we've been dealing with bullies since 4th grade!  Each year I think "this will be the year that it stops."  It hasn't and he is in Junior High.  Funny thing is, he's one of the tallest in the school.  I just don't get it.  Racial slurs, pushing, knocking books out of hands, you name it.  I am against violence but I have finally told him to do whatever he has to, to stand his ground. He will not be punished by me for defending himself.  I guess that it will end when kicks someone's butt!  Hate to say that....

I don't blame you one bit on that, BubleFan1--it just seems to me that students who are bullied should have more options provided by the schools. I had requested at the end of last year that another child that tends to bully my child not be put in the same class with her. Well, guess who was put in her class? I ended up taking up the issue with the assistant principal, and I have to hand it to him that he did take care of the situation, but the child still tries to do mean things to my child at almost every opportunity.

all i have to say is way to go girl. she had every right to stomp on his foot. I am a christian too, but i live right in front of the school. I see alot of kids getting bullied by other kids, and alot of teachers have their attention in a discussion with other teachers not paying attention to the kids. What happened to our no bulling tolerance at school when i was a kid there was no bulling or you get suspended.

My children went to a private Christian school and even there had to deal with situations.  I do believe it is the responsibility of the school and the teachers/aides/principal, etc to provide an atmosphere of safety and acceptance.  When they fail to do that... it turns into what I call "play ground rules".  I told my daughters, "Walk away and tell the teacher or whomever is in charge".  If it continues,  "tell the teacher again".  If the problem was physical bullying and continued without adult intervention... I told them to hit the other kid and hit them so hard they would never want to mess with them again.  If it was emotional bullying... I told them to stay away from the kid and find other kids to play with.   Although my rules may not have been in line with what the school expected... their lack of protection of my child was not what I expected either.  My girls only ever got in trouble a couple of times.  They were not cruel by nature so they did not just beat on other kids for fun.  As a Christian adult, I have different expectations of myself...but I do not expect my child to be a victim unless they choose to be.

Criteeker, your story makes me wonder if bullies grow up to be abusers of their spouses. I wonder if that girlfriend or wife had experienced some of the same treatment or if it was all news to her.

And I've actually heard lots of bully stories about kids in Christian schools too, mickiesings57. It is hard when a kid is emotionally bullying a child and keeps trying to seek that kid out day after day.

Well, this school year has gotten started off pretty rough for us. One child stole my child's special gluten free pretzels and ate them one day. And then the next day she dug her fingernails into her leg deeply enough to make her leg still red that night when my kid got up the guts to tell me about it. Even though she told a teacher each time immediately, that other child got a "warning" each time. She also emotionally bullies my kid. And that was only during the first week of school. When I pushed the issue and the principle spoke with her, she said that she "had a pretty short memory" and didn't recall doing it. I'm pretty mad that the school has a discipline policy that they do not follow consistently.

And that's not to mention that I had to get an extra doctor's note so that my kids could get their food warmed at school after they instituted a new policy with no warning and my oldest didn't get to eat the first day of school.

Then my 5-year-old who is in kindergarten was forgotten in the bathroom and her class was taken to the media center. She said she stood by the door of the empty classroom and thankfully another teacher noticed and helped her to the media center.

Whew...I'm done for now. I feel like Chevy Chase on that scene in Christmas vacation where he ends by asking "Where's the Tylenol?"

wow that must be hard katrena. i don't think schools are what they used to be.

here's my bully story:

i was the only white kid in my grade at a school i attended for a while. i was in 4th grade. white was definitely the minority. well, i was new and didn't really talk much. EVERYDAY when i got off of the bus i was spit on and called a white B****. yes, it was an elementary school. it was VERY traumatic for me. i didn't tell the teachers, bus drivers, or principal. i highly doubt anything would have been done to stop it. it was a number of kids doing it and i never looked back to see who was doing it. if anything it would have probably gotten worse. i've got lots more of those stories. but today i wonder what i would be like if i hadn't gone through all those tough times. i had a hard life but now those things have made me "tough."

in the end kids will be kids, cruel. they say or do mean, hurtful things. nothing will change that. so i think we should just teach our kids to not care about what other people say or do. unless it's physically hurting them. i seen an episode of little bill. a kid at school was wanting to play a game saying mean things back and forth to one another. little bill didn't like it and would get upset but didn't want to be mean back. so his dad taught him to just say "so" when the kid told him something mean. that way you don't have to say anything mean and you're not giving the kid what he wants, attention.

Unfortunately as it regards this thread, attending a Christian School only assures that the bully in question will be Christian.  But bullies come in all stripes.  My wife teaches at a Jewish School and she deals with Jewish bullies.

But she does deal with them decisively.  They are immediately sent to the office where they stay until a parent comes to claim them after being informed of their behavior.  Works pretty well for the really young kids.

12 times??? and yours once back??  how unfair...

When my son was around 9, (he's 28 now) this other boy on his bus was bringing a knife and threatening my boy with it.  I almost came unglued, called the school and they did NOTHING>enter the (now ex) boyfriend.

He hid behind a tree at the busstop the next morning, and JUMPED AND SCREAMED so loud at that kid "HOW DO YOU LIKE BEING SCARED?? HOW DO YOU LIKE IT NOW YOU LITTLE PUNK???"

That stopped that.  I feel sorry for the bullies and the ones who get bullied. 

Wow, MRSverret, that sounds like a horrible experience from your childhood. It sort of reminded me of seeing videos of people throwing bricks at a truck driver in the street. It's amazing what a crowd can get charged up to do.

I am trying to teach my kids to speak up for themselves and trying to work within the system's rules. I think it's so sad when kids can't find a better way to express themselves than to hurt or frighten others.